In this episode of the Triple Win Podcast, JWB Property Management’s Melissa Gillispie talks through the growth she’s seen within the company, and how she’s steered the ship. From hiring the right people, to implementing processes with the right internal and external touchpoints, to selecting and onboarding technology, Melissa provides key insights into how a true leader can grow a property management company effectively.
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Season 5 Episode 5 features Melissa Gillispie, Director of Leasing and Property Management at JWB Property Management.
The Triple Win Property Management Podcast is produced and distributed by Second Nature.
Andrew Smallwood
Hello, professional property managers. Andrew Smallwood here, from Second Nature and the Triple Win Podcast host. I'm joined by my good friend, one of the people I admire, one of the companies I admire a lot in this industry. We've got Melissa Gillispie. She's the Director of Leasing and Property Management at JWB, and she's also the twenty twenty five NARPM Jacksonville chapter president.
She's been in this industry for over a decade, a ton of great experience. And one thing I love about Melissa is not only is she so capable and has such incredible examples, you know, and expertise to share, but that she is so generous about doing that. She goes out of her way to help other property managers all across the country.
You'll see her with multiple blog articles on Second Nature's website. This is not the first time we've had her at a Second Nature event or a podcast. And, man, she's quick to say yes when she can. And so so, anyway, Melissa, so that was my way of introducing folks to you. But tell people what should they know about you, that I missed in your intro.
Melissa Gillispie
Hi, everybody. Thanks, Andrew. That was very nice of you.
What should people know about me that you missed in the intro? I think you covered it pretty well. I fell into property management over a decade ago, found JWB, and now that's really home to me.
And so it's been a wild journey of learning and growing, helping our business scale, and, you know, I learn something new every day. So being on this side of the screen doesn't mean that I don't have plenty to learn too. So I love to share. I love to grow myself and learn and do whatever I can to help other people too. So I think you nailed it. Thanks for having me.
Andrew Smallwood
Absolutely. Alright. Well, I'm excited for a fun conversation. So as we're teeing this up, there was this cool concept of the three t's or, like, the triple t.
And I think the t's were team, touch point, and tech. And when somebody's asking how do I run a great property management business, or what's the lens through which I can see my business and the opportunities in my business? We talk about the triple win lens, and that's kind of a stakeholder lens. But I like this, like, adoption of a new lens with the three t's to kind of look at the opportunities in your business.
And I think you've got experience applying this, and I'd love for you, actually, to share for just a moment, Melissa, of hey, JWV, when you started, you know, eleven, twelve years ago, what did the business look like then? What does the business look like now?
And, you know, we're getting team touch points, tech, and how those have changed and what you've adopted over time. But maybe you could just give us a picture to, like, sort of, like, what it looks like at JWB, from there to here.
Melissa Gillispie
Yeah. So when I first started, there wasn't a team.
There weren't a lot of tech tools, and we were working through what touch points meant. And so it was just a team of one when I joined the team. I made it two.
And we had three hundred doors under management.
So, you know, a midsize property management company at that point, but had really just kind of been winging it, I guess, is the best way to say that, and figuring it out as different problems and challenges and market shifts and things like that happened. And so when I started, there weren't a lot of tools for me. And one of the things that is really important to me is how do we—if we're going to grow, if the goal for us at that time was to grow, we wanted to grow. We were trying to figure out actionable ways to make that happen.
Okay. If we grow within the current infrastructure, we will crumble because there are no guardrails for the staff. There aren't the right tools for the staff. And so it was kind of my mission at the beginning to help build all of that out and make sure that we were structuring ourselves as we grew to be able to continue to be efficient and serve our staff really well, because who wants to step into a mess?
You know, at that time, three hundred doors, it seemed big to me, but now at our size, it was like a mini-mess. And if we just kept on that same trajectory, it would have become a big, big mess. So had to clean it up before you get started. Like, how do you make sure that you're laying that really wonderful foundation so that as you build and as you grow, it's not built on sand that's going to kind of crumble beneath any pressure.
Andrew Smallwood
Wow.
So when you started, hey, call it around three hundred units. JWB now, how many units under management you said?
Melissa Gillispie
There's five-thousand eight-hundred.
Andrew Smallwood
Five thousand eight hundred, and that's just in Jacksonville, right, in a single market?
I know people are gonna ask these questions. I know you've answered them before, but just quick so if people miss this. What percentage of that is, like, single family or, like, you know, small, boutique multifamily?
Melissa Gillispie
Yep. So we have about thirty-two hundred doors, single family. Mhmm. And then the remaining doors are small multifamily, small to midsize. Our largest multifamily is about a hundred and thirty-one units.
But historically, we started out in single family completely. The multifamily piece has been one that's been layered on more recently in the last maybe two years, three years.
Andrew Smallwood
Yep.
And then talk about the team. You said, like, hey, it was just a couple of us there in the beginning with three hundred units. What does the team at JWB look like now?
Melissa Gillispie
Gosh. It's so big. It's big.
So when I started, we were departmentalized, I guess, you might say, in our structure. And so there was one property manager. I was hired as a maintenance coordinator, and then we had one or two folks that were investor client facing. And, shortly after I started, we moved to more of a portfolio style of management, felt that that was going to be best from our size at that time, our team, how our business was structured. And so now there's, like, eight people on our maintenance team.
There are about fifteen on our property management team. And the way that our team is structured is, our property managers are solely resident facing. They handle any and all resident communication unless it's maintenance, and then that's the maintenance team. And then we have about fifteen to twenty client-facing staff, plus accounting and HR and all the other, you know, leasing. There's a team of about ten leasing agents on our team, so certainly have grown quite a bit over the last ten years.
Andrew Smallwood
And so it sounds like you would describe the org structure now as kind of a hybrid of there are some, like, centralized departmental functions, so to speak, that are organized that way, but some of it is also more portfolio in how it how it gets divided into some of those roles.
Melissa Gillispie
Yeah. You know, it's kind of a hodgepodge because we also have just started rolling out within the department some pod structure to where maybe multiple property managers are serving a much larger base of residents. So, you know, rewind to a year ago, one property manager in our organization handled about five hundred doors.
Now you have a team of three who are handling up to two thousand doors. So if you kinda do that math, there's the economy of scale when you have a team of people working together versus the full burden lying on one individual.
Andrew Smallwood
So I think people appreciate that just, like, as an orienting point of reference of kinda like, okay. You guys started here. Now you're in this kind of, like, org structure and design. Here's some of the different roles, how many you have in them to cover it.
Let's talk about, you know, to work with the dozens and dozens and dozens of people that you do across those different roles.
Hiring and onboarding employees is really important. And so can you share, hey, these are some lessons and, like, key things that you've focused on to get hiring and onboarding employees right, to get the right the first t, the right the right team.
Melissa Gillispie
Yes. This starts with, to us, culture. So when we're looking to hire somebody, we're thinking less about their skill set and more about their culture fit. And it's not because the skills don't matter. They certainly do, but we believe that many of the roles in a property management organization can be trained and taught.
You need some fundamental soft skills. Right? You need to be able to be a people person, solve problems, be resilient, kind of handle multiple balls in the air at once, but that can be taught for the most most part of, like, how to actually make a rent collection call or how to actually renew a lease, service a work order, whatever the case might be.
And so culture is our top priority when we're hiring. We want to make sure that anyone we're bringing on board is elevating our team, bringing out the best in our staff, bringing out the best in our customer, and really going to make us all better.
Andrew Smallwood
Mhmm.
Melissa Gillispie
The goal is not to hire a bunch of people who look and act the same. It's also not to hire a bunch of people who are just gonna kind of regurgitate and be task people. We want curious, independent thinkers. So everything we do really needs to align with our core values and our culture, I would say, is kind of the number one way that we approach hiring.
Something else we do on the hiring front, which is a little unique, is we have what's called a shadow interview where we're actually bringing a person into our office prior to being offered on or hired to spend a day with us in the role that they'd be doing. So we typically bring them in on a Tuesday because Tuesdays are when we host our team-wide kind of all hands meeting. We call that “TMM” in our world.
But it allows that person to really see our culture in action because our culture is highlighted significantly in that meeting, and then they get to spend a day in the life. So they are very slightly trained on certain things, and then they jump in. So if you're on a shadow for a property manager role, you're taking calls. We do some role playing.
We're putting you kinda into it because we want to see, one, how you respond.
And it's fun to work alongside you. Like, I want to know. I want to show up and work with you every day. I want to be somebody who cares about what you did on the weekend.
I want to care about your family. I want you to care about me. And so it gives that opportunity to have some true, like, day in the life hands on training before we actually extend an offer. So I guess that's what I would say is most unique about our hiring process and what has helped us, I think, find great talent.
Andrew Smallwood
No, I think that's great. Now I want to ask a couple follow-up questions on this, Melissa, of like, I think a lot of people would probably agree with the idea that hiring for culture matters. And maybe there's people who disagree on the balance of culture and skill and everything else there, or it may depend on the role or situational context, but I think a lot of people would probably agree with that idea. It's a different question of how do you actually assess accurately, right, if somebody's going to be a culture fit in the interview process.
And let me start with that so we can just do that one quick, and then I'll move through the other one.
Melissa Gillispie
Okay.
We have what's called an interview guide for our internal staff for every step of our interview process.
So for our—we actually have an interview called our culture interview.
We have a culture interview guide, and that guide lists all of our core values, and then it lists specific curated questions related to each core value.
And when we interview folks, we have two people from our staff who are interviewing the candidate together.
And so throughout that interview process, everyone knows the goal is to kind of align the person that's sitting in front of us with our core values and our culture guide and say, okay. We've asked all these questions related to, drive, motivation, putting people first, failing forward, doing what's right, not what's easy. What are you passionate about? Right?
We're weaving in all of this questioning that largely has nothing to do with the role. It has everything to do with our team and our culture and the other person's values. Because just because someone's values don't line up with our core values doesn't make them a bad person. It just means that maybe they're not the right fit for our organization.
Andrew Smallwood
Mhmm.
Melissa Gillispie
So I think that interview guide has been critical because before we had that, we were kind of all just guessing and asking different questions.
You know, maybe I would be asking specific questions that I thought were important related to culture, but there was kind of a lack of alignment. And so as we built that out, it has become a tool that's creating a lot of consistency in our interview process Mhmm. While still allowing us to kinda focus in on culture and kind of that fit.
Andrew Smallwood
Okay.
And maybe, like, paint a picture for me. Like, let's pretend you were interviewing, or or actually, let me ask this a different way.
What's a story you can tell us about when you were interviewing somebody and you heard one of the best answers you'd ever heard? Like, what was the question you asked, and what was one of the, like, most memorable or impressive answers you heard? Is it related to putting people first, or is it related to failing forward? Is it related to one of your core values that you were trying to assess? I'd love to hear what was the question you asked and what was, like, the answer you heard that told you, “okay, this is something we want on our team.”
Melissa Gillispie
It's interesting because the one thing that comes to my mind was actually a question the candidate asked us that really wowed me and stood out to me as someone who is driven, motivated, and passionate. They asked—it was it was another woman. We had shared throughout the interview process that we were all moms and, you know, being a woman in business and being a mom, it's a lot of balls you're juggling all at once. And so we had shared some personal things like that. And she asked at the end, you know, what is your advice within your organization for somebody who wants to achieve great things as a professional, but prioritizes family first. And, you know, that to me was just I'm looking for people who have purpose and some driving force of motivation that is beyond themselves. Right?
It's cool if you want money. Everybody wants money. That's why we all show up to a job every day. It's cool if your motivator is helping people. That's great. We help people every day. But I'm looking for what is the thing that is making you show up in the morning and put your best self on day in and day out.
And then on the other kind of side of that, it's, I want somebody who has lofty goals for themselves professionally, who doesn't just want to clock in and clock out and do the task at hand. I want somebody who's just saying, like, I am actively seeking opportunities to push myself and grow and expand my knowledge. And so I think that her asking us that question, it was like the best of both of those things. It's like, how do I show up as a professional and achieve in the way that I want to while still being able to be the very best version of myself for my family?
Andrew Smallwood
Yeah. I like that, of, hey, you could probably hear something different of, like, listening for people's motivations. Right? And whether it's behind their question or behind their answer, you know, are those are those the kind of motivations that are gonna show up and sustain them, you know, as a long term, impact player, right, at JWB and the kind of, the kind of motivations that other people want to be around?
Thank you for sharing that. I've got one more I'm gonna ask you for, which is earlier you talked about setting clear expectations with people.
And maybe you can give us, like, an example or two of that where, in the process, if I were to rewind long ago, it wasn't crisp. It wasn't clear.
Yeah. What are some examples of, like, expectations that you're setting now that you think are really important and really effective as you're bringing new members on the team?
Melissa Gillispie
That's a great question.
So some of the expectations are very basic. Like, show up on time. To work here, you show up on time.
And that makes it very clear from day one what we expect. Like, we're not a lax culture where you just kinda stroll in at whatever point you want to, and nobody's really monitoring that. We expect you to, you know, be butt in seat, computer open, ready to answer the phone when you're supposed to be here. Not like chatting in the kitchen and walking through the parking lot. We want you ready to work. Like, that's just our culture. That's who we are.
So that's one that you'd think it's expected and known, but we make it clear to just answer it and stay.
Another one might be our commitment to service to our residents. So when I'm training a property manager and we're talking through, first day, you know, how do we show up for our resident? We have an expectation of responding to all emails and text messages from our residents within twenty-four hours in an emergency situation and forty-eight hours in a nonemergency situation.
We have an expectation to answer ninety percent of every phone call that comes into our office every single day. So as they are getting acclimated to their role and understanding all of the different moving parts, they know how to prioritize communication to the resident.
The worst thing that can happen is a resident says they haven't heard from us or we don't answer our phone or we don't call people back. That's just, like, basic rule number one. So things like that where it—I think sometimes as leaders, we assume people just know those things and are going to do them without us explicitly saying it. And what I’ve found in my experience working with lots of different people is not everyone does know those things, or maybe they've never been taught or told. Maybe this is the first work environment that has those sorts of expectations. So I try never to assume someone knows already.
Andrew Smallwood
I like this because if you were to ask somebody, “hey, what does a commitment to service, right, or commitment to service to residents mean?”
Yeah. Yes. Different people at different companies, they just, directionally, probably, everyone gets it. It's intuitive.
And yet, hey. Are we responding within two business days? Are we responding within one? Or are we responding within this period of time?
Right? Yeah. Being specific about the responsiveness that you all expect that shows a commitment, right, to service and makes people feel that, you know, it sounds like that that's where you guys are, kind of identifying, like, here's what's really, really important there.
Okay. Now you mentioned—I'm gonna transition here, Melissa. You mentioned a couple times, like, hey. There's different touch points. Right?
In that process, and that's a keyword. It's the second t, touch points. When you talk about touch points, is that what you mean? Is it, interactions with different customers, parts of a process? Is it interactions internally in meetings or performance reviews, or is it something else? When you talk about the right touch points, what do you mean by that?
Melissa Gillispie
It's both.
It's both internal touch points you have with your staff.
You can't put people on an island, never talk to them, tell them what to do once, and think that it's going to go well. You need to be supportive. You need to be a coach. You need to know what it means to be a leader who is going to motivate and inspire and demand great results.
So it's touch points internally with the staff, and then it's also key touch points in the process that we have found lead to great results. So if I'm using an example of a touch point internally, we do weekly one-to-one meetings with our staff. Every single employee in our organization meets with their direct supervisor or manager every week for at least an hour, and that meeting is the employee's meeting. That is not my meeting to just give them more to-do's or whatever. It's not my meeting. It's their meeting. They come prepared.
What do they need from me? What questions might they have? What's going on personally or professionally that might be interfering with their ability to show up as their best self in that moment?
What are their goals? How do they want to achieve them? Do they want me to help hold them accountable to those goals? I happily will do that. Right?
What are our goals as a team? What are their individual work-related goals? Are we on pace to meet those goals? So the purpose of that one to one is really dedicated time with every single staff, because people need that level of support. Like, I can't quite quantify that Other than it seems our team has always really valued that time, and our teammates come prepared. That's another expectation we might be setting is how to come prepared to your one-to-one meetings.
So that would be an example of an internal touch point that we find very, very important. Even if it's not weekly or even if it's not the same length of time, showing up in a way that your team knows you're available and willing to help support them in the ways that they need and that you care about them personally and professionally goes a really long way to generating a team that is committed and motivated and happy.
I mean, I want my staff to be happy.
So for another example is, on our work order system, the way that we do that is each category of work order is assigned a specific priority.
So if it is, “no plumbing in the home,” that's an emergency priority.
And if it's, you know, maybe it's a, “my fence is wiggly and, you know, it might fall one day.” That's a low priority.
And based on the priority, we then assign how often we touch base with that resident.
So if it's an emergency, we're touching base every single day, maybe multiple times a day. If it is a low priority, we're probably touching base every three or four days.
And it allows our team to honestly work our work orders like a pipeline.
Right? You're putting it in follow-up, and you're kicking the can down the road for three days for offense, and you're saying this is urgent and important. I'm going to follow-up at every moment as I have new information with a resident who's having an emergency situation. So, yes, full circle answering the question completely.
It's both.
Andrew Smallwood
Okay. And here's what I kinda want to ask you before we move to the last one is, what are one or two touch points internal or external that you think are some of the biggest missed opportunities in this industry? Meaning, it's something you're seeing ninety-five percent of property managers are not doing this. Right?
But it's something you guys have chosen to do at JW, and it's a big difference maker. Right? What comes to mind of one or two examples like that?
Melissa Gillispie
The first one is we have what we call new move in calls, and that's a call made to somebody who has moved into a property in the first week that they have lived there.
This is so important because the move in experience is a make or break experience.
They're going to think about your company in the way that they experienced you throughout that process.
And if it's going great, it's fun to know that. Okay. Great. I'm so glad everything's wonderful.
I'm always here if you need me. Let me know if anything pops up. So glad to hear it was great.
Maybe that's an opportunity for a Google review, asking for a positive Google review.
If it has not gone so great, for example, you know, we've had somebody move in, and the day they show up to the house, we did a move in inspection twenty-four hours prior, which is pretty close in line with when they're moving in, and the home had been broken into. And they got to the home with their U-Haul, and the door was kicked in and the appliances were gone.
If you don't respond well in those moments, you are screwed for the next two to three years with that person because no matter what you do good moving forward, that is all that they're going to remember. And so we've found that just prioritizing very early on just, “how are you doing? Are we settled? Anything you need?” has just been an x factor to, if there is a problem, it's still reactive, but at least it's quick.
And you have time to say, oh my gosh. Let me get right on that. I'm going to get it fixed for you today or tomorrow depending on what the issue is. And what else can I do?
Do I need to order you dinner tonight? Do we need to—whatever it is. What do we need to do? We'll fix it.
And so I think it just gives that extra touch and extra show of care that we really want the experience to be wonderful as well as getting in front of any potential negative experiences that might have happened.
Andrew Smallwood
Okay. So I think that should take us to the final t. People have been looking forward to this, technology.
And, you know, you guys have adopted technology, and I know you got a unique setup there. But even thinking about other technologies that you guys have evaluated and adopted in the process, can you talk about your decision process of just, what's your mindset on evaluating and adding new technology at JWB?
Melissa Gillispie
A really good question. I think it's evolved and changed over the years. The way we used to look at it is very different than the way that we look at it today.
We actually, going back to kind of the team and what you need on a team, we've started investing in some tech-skilled staff who are able to really help us.
So I think that if you're in a place where you're trying to figure out, where's my technology, how do I enhance it, how do I tie it all together and set my team up for success, investing even if it's—there's a lot of, remote resources for technology in that space. So many skilled people that love to offer their service. And so that to me is really important, but it's evolved into kind of like a, I don't want to call it a committee. It's not really a committee, but our leadership team serves as the barrier between requests and ideas and creativity and what we action on. And so right now, we're working through enhancing our call platform across our entire organization.
AI and all of this, there's so many tech resources that are already available, coming available.
I feel I get every Broker/Owner and Nationals I've been to in the past eighteen months, everything is just tech tech heavy. How do we automate? How do we systematize?
How do we leverage the tools and resources at our fingertips? Which is amazing.
And one of the areas is, you know, having a better call system where when someone calls, the caller pops up on your screen. And when you're talking, it can save down that recording right there on the record you're on, and maybe it can even listen to your calls for you and give you feedback and scoring based off of the call. And so we're like, that's really cool. So the way that we've looked at it recently is, okay, what is going to have the most global impact across the entire organization?
And then kind of a cost benefit analysis. Right? How much efficiency do we believe this is going to create with our staff?
Is this going to save everybody five minutes a week, or is this going to save everybody an hour a week or five hours a week? And we want the biggest bang for our buck. So if we're gonna spend however much money on a new tech or a new tool or resource, we want to make sure that we are truly going to see the value in that from a kind of capacity standpoint, I guess, is how we look at it.
Because I'm not going to spend a bunch of money if it makes everybody's job harder or if it keeps everybody's job the same. Like, it doesn't make a lot of sense to do that. So for us, it's all about what capacity does this create to allow people to do more of what is a value add from a human standpoint.
Right? What do we want our humans doing? We want them talking to people. We want them engaging and being creative and solving problems and using judgment.
And then what can we allow technology to support that is going to free everybody up to spend more time on doing those things? So I think that's kind of how we've looked at it.
You know, it depends on where you are in your business, I think, on what the most important tools and resources are. You know, if you're a small business and you don't have a whole lot of staff and you're having trouble managing, maybe you're needing to really look at what's the best CRM to manage a pipeline or manage communication so that that's done well.
Or maybe, you know, with maintenance, you don't want to have a huge team. And so you're like, well, what troubleshooting AI can I use that helps me kind of take away that part of the maintenance role or dispatching vendor assignment, things like that? You know? There's so many different property management-specific tech tools that are now in existence.
So I guess it's hard to answer it as, like, this is the way to do it. I think everybody is going to do that a little differently depending on where they are kind of in their business at the moment. But for us, I do still think that no matter where you are, you should think through, is this am I gonna get the return on this investment in my people and in what we can handle. Because if you're spending money on things that there's no return on that investment, it's creating more work or more burden, definitely not worth the time or money.
So that's kind of what's been our driving force.
Global impact and efficiency and scale.
Andrew Smallwood
Awesome. Awesome.
Okay.
Melissa, I'm just gonna ask one or two fun questions to help kinda close this out here, which would be, if you were sitting in front of, the Melissa G., you know, ten years ago. Like, you're a year into this. You're working on units three-hundred to four-hundred, so to speak.
And you can only give yourself two pieces of advice. Right? You've got just two minutes and you're like, okay. I can say two things to this person. Right?
What would you want to say in those precious moments? What advice would you give yourself?
Melissa Gillispie
Sometimes speed and growth is better than being perfect.
Like, the faster you iterate, the faster you get to great results, so don't be afraid to take a risk or make a leap.
I think that's really important. I'm not inherently a risk taker, and so I think, like, the speed in which I've become comfortable with some risk has really helped kind of catapult me and our business.
And then, I think it's like, this is a people business.
So as much as we all want to get everything done and have really great results, the experience of the people we impact really matters, whether that's our staff or our customer or our community.
It's a people business, and we need to keep people at the forefront.
I am very results-driven.
So sometimes I'm quick to prioritize results over people, which sounds terrible, maybe.
But I think people are—we wouldn't have successful businesses if it weren't for our customers, our community, and our team. So keeping people at the front.
This is hard!
Andrew Smallwood
Okay. And when you look to the future of, like, what's what's in front of you and JWB and the professional property management industry, what possibilities or opportunities excite you most?
Melissa Gillispie
I think for me, it is AI.
It is harnessing and using AI in a way that is healthy and still prioritizes people.
Andrew Smallwood
Mhmm.
Melissa Gillispie
Where I just think that there are so many really wonderful tools and technology that exist today that didn't exist, you know, ten years ago that can help us and free us up to be the creative, inspiring, thoughtful, problem solving people that we want. So I think using AI to elevate our expertise, elevate our industry, elevate our teams so that we are truly, like, operating at our highest and best use and value as a human being, to me is what got me really juiced and excited lately.
Andrew Smallwood
Man, I think there's a lot of promise and a lot of excitement for these tools to help work through a lot of the mundane and get into more creative and strategic work. And, and I think that we're seeing a lot of people in the industry not, not fear these tools, but, like, embrace these tools. It's like, okay. I'm going from typewriter to MacBook Pro here. Right?
And the possibilities for that, you know, in property management. There's so much activity. There is so much, things happening, and the ability to get more efficient with that and level things up, it holds a lot of promise, right, for the years ahead. So love that you shared that and a great note to end on. Melissa, thanks as always. Walking through the three t's and the opportunities for, I mean, if you got the right team, you've got the right touch points, you've got the right technology and systems in place, it can put you in a great position to to grow your business, and you and JWB have done just that. So I appreciate you, sharing that, walking through that, giving examples as we went.
Really appreciate it. Always enjoy the time.
Melissa Gillispie
Thanks for having me. Thanks for giving me the opportunity. It's fun to share. Hopefully, there was a nugget for somebody out there.